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Random Ethical Debate

Discussion in 'Media' started by CattyCat, Sep 18, 2016.

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Is "ladies first" sexist(ish), annoying(ish), etc?

  1. Yes (male)

    2 vote(s)
    22.2%
  2. Yes (female)

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  3. No (male)

    6 vote(s)
    66.7%
  4. No (female)

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  5. I don't know (male)

    1 vote(s)
    11.1%
  6. I don't know (female)

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
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  1. CattyCat

    CattyCat Member

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    Hey guys, I have a Random Ethical Debate for you. Today, I want to ask you whether "ladies first" is sexist(ish), annoying(ish), etc.

    Just for clarification, I'm not talking about whether holding doors for someone would be sexist (honestly, that's just being polite), but rather, these scenarios (and any similar/related scenarios you guys can think of):

    So, at my graduation party a couple years ago, there was cake (duh). But, the vice principal, Mr. R*, let the girls get the cake first, waited 10 minutes or so before letting the boys go. The same thing happened many years before than, except it involved candy and it was not a grad party. So by the time all the girls got the candy, there would be fewer choices for the boys (and most of the good candy would be gone).

    *Not the name the students refer to him as.
    I read a post on thetoptens called "Reasons kids hate school". I came to this section called Favoritism among Teachers. It really doesn't describe anything "ladies first", but still, go check it out. It is still heavily related to what I'm talking about.
    Can't forget the Titanic.

    Note that in modern-day society, there are no more knights in shining armor that have to rescue damsels in distress from Ender Dragons or whatever.

    In the poll above, state your opinion and whether you are male or female (no bias please). Please support your opinion with relevant facts. I would also like you to answer the questions below. Also, describe whether the above scenarios (and others you can think of) would be considered fair. Please answer all questions here.

    Think about it: if "ladies first" suddenly became "gentlemen first", how would you feel (why is it not vice versa)? Or what if "ladies first" suddenly became "no gender always gets to go first"? What about "whites first" or "blacks first" (racism)?
     
    Last edited: Sep 19, 2016
  2. Jordanzz

    Jordanzz Member

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    If i gave you my full and honest opinion about this id be here a while typing :p Basically i feel that men should always show respect towards women unless obviously they aren't showing any to you. If doesn't have to be as formal as "ladies first" but i feel there should be some kind of respect. My opinion on this "ladies first" isn't being sexist, it's a man showing respect to a woman and a good quality to have for a guy i personally think. It shows maturity and selflessness. Obviously if a girl is screaming it in your face then they are abusing that respect but i don't know :pThat's kinda my view on this.
     
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  3. RockBob4

    RockBob4 Member

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    I think it is polite to let ladies go first. I don't think this is sexist. Some girls might get defensive about it. That's just how my mom raised me.
     
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  4. CattyCat

    CattyCat Member

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    So, how do ladies show respect to gentlemen (other than "please", "thank you", etc)?
    Please support your opinion with facts.


    Does it mean that guys can never go first?
     
  5. RockBob4

    RockBob4 Member

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    No it doesn't it's just polite to let ladies go first. You should be kind to everybody.
     
  6. CattyCat

    CattyCat Member

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    But why ladies? Why not gentlemen?


    This is literally the key question of my thread to be honest. This is kinda outdated, and there's literally no reason why this should be in modern day society.
     
  7. RockBob4

    RockBob4 Member

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    Why not? If you don't like it you don't have to say it. I will always say it. I know that females are not lesser, or need any special attention, but it is nice to be nice. I would not be courteous to butt in front of a girl or anyone else. For me it is just being chivalrous. I know that there are no more knights, but if you are trying to get a girlfriend this would probably be appreciated.
     
  8. Terrarialover11

    Terrarialover11 Member

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    Unless it is taken to extremes, where a woman would expect everything done for her, I don't mind the expression nor persuing it. I personally feel that being a gentleman has become much more rare, as a result some women don't expect that in a man and wont care for that trait when dating or choosing friends. I believe the Pygmalion Effect to be mostly true, women get treated better, they'll likely look for someone who treats them as you should treat a women (not trying to genralize saying all women want the same treatment or that mannerism holds no value towards men). Basically giving people a little bit more self-respect that is much needed nowadays when it's so easy to be offended and fickle.
     
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  9. RockBob4

    RockBob4 Member

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    Well said Terra.
     
  10. CattyCat

    CattyCat Member

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    Hmm, you do have a point, but why is it not vice versa? Is it common for "ladies first" to be abused in any way? Can it ever get unfair (see the scenarios above)? That's kind of why I started this post.
     
  11. RockBob4

    RockBob4 Member

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    I guess it comes from a while ago when it was expected from everyone. It can be abused, but you should just deal with it and not complain. Be the bigger person. Mostly it is respect.
     
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  12. MrTokay

    MrTokay Member

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    I don't understand how that's sexist at all.
    Since women are naturally reliant and Men naturally the leaders of society, the term "ladies first" was borne out of that.
    Saying that it's sexist is would just come from a selfish guy.
     
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  13. TheQueenWaddle

    TheQueenWaddle Member

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    Fun fact: The whole "ladies first" thing started on the prairie when they had to pack up and leave, because they got had to carry the kids on or something (I read this on a shady website, so not 100% reliable)

    How ironic.
    THAT'S SEXIST. Girls don't need anything to slay in this society; hell, look at Beyonce. She's an ABSOLUTE queen w/ Jay-Z having the nerve to cheat on her. When did a girl ever need a guy? All I see now are the rednecks shooting deer and voting for Donald Trump, but that's an entirely different speech.
    This really pisses me off.

    I mean, you shouldn't need facts to have an opinion. I just thing it's VERY reasonable w/ how long women have been oppressed like cRaZY. Like
    Crazy oppressed.
    Crazy.
     
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  14. Pandrai

    Pandrai Member

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    This is in no way sexist, I think this is just being polite and showing respect to the woman, I know that I treat my girlfriend like she the center of my world and she knows it. If a guy cant say "Ladies first" if they both walk into a cash register aisle at almost the same time at a grocery store that's just plain wrong.
     
  15. Terrarialover11

    Terrarialover11 Member

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    I agree it can be taken advantage of, which is why I said I don't mind it as long as it isn't used wrongly. I also said that manners should go both ways, but what's so wrong with women going first in somega areas that ultimately don't effect much? In my opinion it just shows politeness from men, something that from my experience isn't too common anymore.
     
  16. TheQueenWaddle

    TheQueenWaddle Member

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    Also, it's been "gentlemen first" since like... forever.
    Just wanna put that out there.
     
  17. Terrarialover11

    Terrarialover11 Member

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    You're right, it's always been men first in:
    - Way higher likelyhood to die at work
    - Way higher likelyhood to be homeless
    - Way higher likelihood to be victim of assault
    - Way higher likelihood to loose custody of your children in the case of divorce

    The list goes on, but please, continue to tell me how it's men first in today's misogynistic world. It bad for both sides, no need to make it seem exclusive to women :)
     
  18. TheQueenWaddle

    TheQueenWaddle Member

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    Let's take a little walk through history:
    - Greece: the "democracy" was limited to only male citizens
    - In general, first ones to vote (basically everywhere)
    - Middle East: Women must have all parts of their bodies clothed; there was a mall in Morocco (not middle east, but North Africa where cultures are similar) that had a sign torn down because Gap advertised with a giant sign of a women wearing a tank top a jeans
    - Not allowed to leave the house w/o their spouse
    - Some parts still practice sati, where the woman is required to burn herself on a funeral pyre if she is widowed
    - In some religions polygamy is accepted but once a wife has multiple lover she's considered a (expletive)
    - Apparently rape is an "accident" now
    - Incredulous workplace discrimination (still a thing)
    - Generalizing men as dominant in the workforce
    - Us men somehow get to decide how a woman gets to treat her body/baby (like seriously?)
    - Can't run for President? Hillary, please.


    Your points:
    - Didn't know about that. Hmm
    - This too
    - Yet females are at a much higher risk of being sexually assaulted, which again, apparently becomes a "mistake" or "accident"
    - Over 80% of single parents are moms, because the dad decides to leave. This is reasonable.

    Sure, it isn't all rainbows and happiness for men, but women have been undercut WAYYYYYYYYYY more. You can't argue otherwise.
     
  19. Terrarialover11

    Terrarialover11 Member

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    Your points about history and foreign countries have no validation here, for ladies first never existed there to begin with. Those countries in which women are actually oppressed need a lot more than just equal rights between women and men js.

    Notice I said assault, as in muggings and such, but if you want to include sexual assaults in prison it's not too different between men and women.

    Who said women can't run for president?

    There's a difference between getting becoming a single parent (by having the man leave the mother and child) and divorce. Divorce is settled more reasonably and gender shouldn't be a determining factor when it comes to your kids that your fighting for. That's just offsetting the power because your a women i.e. Sexism against men.

    It's not men deciding how women get to "treat their body" (abortion and such) Half the population agrees with pro-life, so it would stand to reason if half the country disagrees on something it still needs further consideration.

    Please tell me where in today's western world is rape an accident?
     
  20. Pandrai

    Pandrai Member

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    This turned into a full on debate about who has it worse...this started off by saying something as simple as "ladies first" puuuhlllleeesssseeee ppl calm down
     
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